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msmemory_archive ([personal profile] msmemory_archive) wrote2008-10-26 03:06 pm
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So the Crown gives an AOA to "Madame E"

Does that make her Lady Madame E? Lady E of Iron Bog? Madame Lady E?
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[identity profile] liamstliam.livejournal.com 2008-10-26 07:16 pm (UTC)(link)
What is the significance of the "Madame?"

What is she stylizing herself as?

[identity profile] talvinm.livejournal.com 2008-10-26 08:25 pm (UTC)(link)
Madame E, AOA

AO
AAAO
Court is done and we wan' go ho-ome!

[identity profile] baron-elric.livejournal.com 2008-10-26 08:28 pm (UTC)(link)
Does this woman have a registered name? If so, I imagine it would be "Lady E(whatever)."

I don't know that the word Madame has any recognition within the SCA. (Certainly not as a job title.) It means Mrs., and marital titles aren't normally used in names. Moreover, the contraction of two French words into one, as far as I know, didn't happen until the late seventeenth century.

[identity profile] baron-elric.livejournal.com 2008-10-27 04:22 am (UTC)(link)
Please reassure me that she has a name and not just an initial.

[identity profile] baron-steffan.livejournal.com 2008-10-27 04:06 pm (UTC)(link)
It seems to me we have a couple of choices here.

According to Da Roolz, [personal profile] tashabear is right: "Madame" is listed as the French alternative for the SCA title of "Lady". But (Heaven forfend I should question Da Roolz!), Da Roolz are wrong. "Madame" is in fact the direct equivalent of the English "milady", and thus appropriate for a French non-armiger. The French for "lady", despite what Da Roolz say, is "Dame".

Now, consider a Scadian who calls himself "Captain Jack". (In fact, my apprentice, Lord Elias Gedney, soon to be Master Elias Gedney, calls himself Captain Elias Gedney, and I suspect will continue to do so after Twelfth Night.) What is Captain Jack's Scadian forename? We can consider it "Captain" (which I think is silly), or we can discard the unofficial (non)title and consider his name to be "Jack" (which strikes me as more logical).

Ergo...this non-armigerous French lady has been referred to as "madame", i.e. "milady" E, as is appropriate, but she is now "Lady E". And since there is no indication of a byname, she would be, by tradition and to avoid later confusion, listed with her home branch as her byname.

I would therefore list her as "E of Ostgardr", AoA 2008.10.25.

I'd also strongly encourage her to get a real name now that she's been recognized at Court, but that's just me....
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